Fearing Faux and Artificial Intelligence

Anticipating what spews forth from the up-coming presidential debate, which is the biggest threat: fake, factious falsehoods of fools or the autonomy of inhuman robots? Scientists are mulling over the latter at the International Joint Conference on Artificial Intelligence in Buenos Aires, Argentina while political scientists roll their eyes at the former.

The Guardian at http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jul/27/musk-wozniak-hawking-ban-ai-autonomous-weapons notes:
Musk and Hawking have warned that AI is “our biggest existential threat” and that the development of full AI could “spell the end of the human race”. But others, including Wozniak have recently changed their minds on AI, with the Apple co-founder saying that robots would be good for humans, making them like the “family pet and taken care of all the time”.

So too is what comes forth from the insanities of the candidacies.


About patd

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people. The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad. Alice: How do you know I'm mad? The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.
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60 Responses to Fearing Faux and Artificial Intelligence

  1. patd says:

    re ai conference from http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-33686581
    Killer robots: Tech experts warn against AI arms race

    re ff conference from http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/koch-brothers-wealthy-donors-gop-2016-freedom-partners-seminar-california-120663.html Koch brothers summon Bush, Cruz, Walker, Rubio to SoCal confab
    Freedom Partners’ annual summer conference is set for August 1 through August 3, and is expected to draw 450 of the biggest financiers of the right for sessions about the fiscally conservative policies and politics that animate the billionaire industrialist brothers Charles and David Koch and many of the donors in their network. Most have the capability to write seven- or even eight-figure checks to the super PACs fueling the GOP presidential primary, and a significant proportion have yet to settle on a 2016 choice, or are considering supporting multiple candidates. That includes Charles and David Koch, as well as Las Vegas casino mogul Sheldon Adelson and hedge fund billionaires Paul Singer, both of whom will be represented at the conference by advisers, and a number of other attendees of past conferences whose 2016 leanings are being closely watched.


  2. rebelliousrenee says:

    Just stopping by to say Hi. I’m relaxing for a few days before I set my booth up this Thursday.
    I see that the first gop debate will be the following Thursday. Don’t know if I’ll see any of it… but I do look forward to reading the reactions here.

    Oh yeah… Hillary will be the next president…. resistance is futile… you will be assimilated. 🙂


  3. Flatus says:

    There’s a really interesting feature in this morning’s Times about the training of substance-sniffing dogs. The ideal trainers, it seems, are long term inmates at penitentiaries. The inmates lack all the faults and drawbacks of their socialized counterparts living in free and open society. In essence, the inmates fulfill the role of very intelligent androids with less maintenance. Their success rate at producing trained K-9s are orders of magnitude above socialized humans.

    Now, we are locking pilots in darkened rooms in the Nevada desert to fly our Predator drones in lethal strikes against our enemies. The duty is debilitating. The pilots hate it. They are leaving the Air Force in droves. What to do? Turn the job over to long-term inmates with requisite aptitudes, or depend more on expert systems?


    • Pogo says:

      The archetypal video game afficionado would never pass the Air Force physical. I don’t think turning the job over to long term inmates is a good long term strategy – you wouldn’t want to piss them off.


  4. Jamie says:

    Thank you thank you thank you. 🙂 As to AI, I’m basically in favor of it with one rather large problem. People do not do well when they have nothing to do. More and more jobs are being wiped out while the population continues its Ponzi style increase. Millions of people with no real income or useful purpose are going to get themselves into a whole lot of trouble. If A.I. is handling the “necessary” work of the world in the sense of manufacturing and keeping everything organized. People will need income (or product) sources while performing elective “jobs” … Plant trees, grow gardens, teach children, tend the elderly, paint, play music, create theater etc. … a WPA for the future. Something always needs to be done by someone and people will need to be paid in some way to do it.


  5. blueINdallas says:

    “Open the pod bay doors…Daisy, Daisy…”

    ICE arrested 27 illegal immigrants in Dallas and a town just south of here. Organized crime to DUIs, so not just folks here for legit jobs.

    ICE says of the 15K removed from this area last year, about 85% had criminal convictions.

    So, can we just get a decent guest-worker program (if that is even needed – we should make sure our citizens have jobs, first), so that anyone not here legally would clearly not just be a person looking for a paycheck?

    Can we also employ our engineers/tech people instead of giving work visas to people from other countries who do not have unique qualifications? That way, the large salaries they earn might get pumped back into our economy instead of being sent back to their home countries.


  6. blueINdallas says:

    I hope the Minnesota dentist who killed the lion in Zimbabwe never knows another moment’s peace. The same goes for any other “trophy” hunters. Learn to golf or something. Jeez!


    • Jamie says:

      This one goes in the “Even a broken clock is right twice a day” column. Newt Gingrich tweeted: “The entire team that killed the lion cecil should go to jail including the Minneapolis dentist”


  7. patd says:

    renee, good luck on your booth sales this year. is it likely that a stray candidate will stroll by and perhaps buy one (or be given one if he/she would be an appropriate recipient)? can imagine lindsey in a soft mauve…. and maybe bernie in hot pink. nothing, please, for d. troll tho


  8. patd says:

    flatus, they train horses too: blm’s Colorado Wild Horse Inmate Program

    other good inmate apprentice (construction, electrical, healthcare) programs in some states, but don’t think drone warfare one of them.


  9. patd says:

    from http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/07/28/1406588/-McConnell-blinks-on-highway-bill-Boehner-wins?detail=hide#
    “The House is expected to vote on the three-month extension on Wednesday, and the Senate will likely take it up on Thursday. That means everyone can go home for the long August recess pretending like they did something great in keeping highway projects funded through the busy roadtrip vacation season.”

    and once again they vacate on our dime…. rather several dimes, like $174,000 per year each, plus benefits


  10. Pogo says:

    This is really a holdover from the prior thread, but what the hay?

    Polls, polls, polls. Polls my butt.


    The only CNN poll (released today) on RCP showing a Rep. advantage in head to head general election between the top 2 dems and top 3 Reps is Bush v. Sanders, with Bush hoding a 1 point lead. In all other such polls Hillary or Bernie win by 5-21 points. Last week, Quinnipiac showed the ‘pugns winning all head to head races. That same day PPP had dems winning in 6 of 8 matchups. So much for polls.

    But wait, get a load of these congressional approval numbers — http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/congressional_job_approval-903.html

    It has to be really hard to generate numbers like that – a -57.8 point disapproval gap. Obama’s -5 point average looks like he won Miss Congeniality by comparison.

    And the upcoming ‘pugn debate for the fortunate 10 and forum for the rest – pass teh popcorn. I’d suggest a drinking game – a shot for everymention of (a) Obama (b) Hillary or (c) Bernie. My prediction, for (a) or (b) you’ll never hear the end of the debate, having passed out long before its conclusion. For (c), you should be able to drive home safely.


  11. tony says:

    New York Times Corrects Explosive Hillary Clinton Email Story Amid Campaign Pushback
    The debate over the article makes it clear how delicate reporting on Clinton’s emails has become.
    Yah, its appeared on its website for maybe 3 hours and now you have to do a Google search to find it.. Sad, the Grey lady stinks!!! Liberal media bias, oh too funny..


    • Jamie says:

      Tony, Rachel Maddow actually took on the lousy reporting by the Times tonight. For more than 30 years, Hillary has been declared guilty of everything from typos to murder. Not once in all that time has been any actual proof of wrongdoing of any kind on her part. She may be protective and secretive, but she just very well could have damn good reasons. It isn’t paranoia when they really are out to get you.


  12. and truck frump promises to appoint palin to his cabinet oy


  13. Jamie says:

    Actually enjoyed first hour of Morning Joe this AM (Don’t ask why I was up at three). Mika had my political nervous breakdown for me. Surrounded by men with Joe Jackass leading the pack, she practically came to tears trying to get them to talk about substance instead of all the gossip, garbage, and hyperbole that is the media frenzy of this year’s Presidential campaign.


  14. Jamie says:

    Jimmy Kimmel took on the lion killer, ” Is it that hard for you to get an erection? They have a pill for that. If you took Viagra you could save yourself from being the most hated man in America who never advertised jell-o pudding”. http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/jimmy-kimmel-chokes-up-air-811799


  15. patd says:

    not exactly on subject, but must pay tribute to the clever clucky commercials of late…’course it’s the music that makes them good not the poor overworked underpaid (scratch at most) actors



  16. Jamie says:

    And then there is that horrid Volkswagen commercial with the elderly ladies. I don’t have a clue as to how that thing is supposed to sell something to anyone. It’s pretty bad though when some of the most intelligent, well acted material is shown during the commercial breaks.


  17. Flatus says:

    Going back to artificial intelligence. Or using our intelligence to save (American) lives in warfare, or to provide more leisure time for people the world round (at the expense of people in the invisible world).

    Before we, militarists, became so intelligent, we called things that gave us a decided advantage over an enemy ‘force multipliers’. As an example, with the introduction of machine guns at the turn of the last century a squad of troops could stop a company. Finally, we became so intelligent that we developed and dropped two quite small (really) atomic bombs that have stopped world wars for the past seventy years and counting…

    Our ability to capture the nuances of human thought and action and model those thoughts and actions into increasingly intellectualized computerized platforms have given us freedom from cataclysm over those decades. And in the ‘small’ wars in which we have been involved, we have killed our enemies at decidedly high ratios compared with our losses. But, we lack the national will to end small wars decisively so they keep resurrecting. And we are unwilling to share the losses that we do experience across all social levels.

    The algorithms embodied within our artificial intelligence platforms are among our most vital national secrets and should be protected as such. Spies, such as Pollard, should never be set free.


  18. Pogo says:

    Flatus, fear of AI is an interesting concept to me. I see it as fear of an unknown and uncontrollable enemy. It strikes me as odd that people seem to fear it more than our known uncontrollable enemies. The unknown AI platforms you refer to are beyond the knowledge and comprehension of most people (me included), and most of them probabaly don’t have a grasp that AI exists at all, and to the extent that the platform can’t write it’s own algorithms, it is just sophisticated programming. The decision trees are ours if I understand it correctly. People who are afraid of AI I believe are afraid of a much broader and comprehensive platform that igniores its programming and modifies its own decision trees to protect itself, a la Hal 9000 & Skynet. I’m pretty sure we have the ability to build in decision algorithms to prevent that kind of self awareness and runaway independent action. (Those are fictional, right?) Yes, compters that can beat humans at chess, poker and blackjack seem intelligent, but they are essentially nothing more than platforms that apply more rules than a human can retain and apply in real time. Weapons systems – I defer to you. Until compurter can respond to stupidity with “that’s bullshit” AI is an interesting concept, but not much of a threat to the humans that design it.


  19. patd says:

    pogo, that computer that can respond to stupidity with “that’s bullshit” will also be programed to eliminate said bs and the bs-er creator….which will leave very few of us left.
    this is a good discussion of ai by the guy who wrote the novel “the war after Armageddon” (try to ignore the idiot interviewing him). http://video.foxbusiness.com/v/4384368624001/should-artificial-intelligence-be-feared/?#sp=show-clips
    Should artificial intelligence be feared?
    Jul. 29, 2015 – 4:41 – Fox News Strategic Analyst Lt. Col. Ralph Peters discusses the likelihood of intelligent machines posing a threat to national security.


  20. patd says:

    flatus, “Spies, such as Pollard, should never be set free”??? but what if they are good bargaining chips and can be swapped for something of real value/necessity?


  21. patd says:

    a new yucky term now to endure on the news, in comic monologues and from obnoxious neighbors:
    After months of bubbling away in the dark recesses of the internet, the term “cuckservative” broke big this past week as a way for white supremacists to mock any conservative who isn’t racist, anti-Semitic, or homophobic enough for them, which is all of them except Donald Trump. Even Mike Huckabee couldn’t impress them with his “Marching the Israelis to the ovens” remarks, and they have cleverly taken to calling him “Mike Cuckabee.”

    but then i shouldn’t whine about the above since meself is guilty of using the terms kochkold and koch-servative without hesitation.


  22. whskyjack says:

    Well as long as they build in an on off switch or a place to cut the power. I ain’t scared of no machine, but I did have a car once………………………



  23. tony says:

    Hillary Clinton To Appear Before Benghazi Committee
    She’ll testify on October 22.


  24. tony says:

    Sean Hannity is killing the GOP: Fox News & conservative media have the party in a stranglehold
    Today’s GOP is incapable of effective governance, and a new paper shows how Fox News and talk radio are to blame


  25. patd says:

    from http://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/2015/07/30/toyota-gliding-human-support-robot-can-pick-up-after-elderly-help-sick/
    Nearly 40 percent of Japan’s population will be 65 or older by 2060, and with the rest of the developed world and some developing nations following that track, Toyota is banking on the demand for robot helpers to grow.
    “People feel more comfortable asking a robot to pick up after them than asking a human helper,” said Tadashi Hatakenaka, manager and engineer at the Yokohama Rehabilitation Center.


  26. Tony says:

    Christie: Smoke Your Weed While It’s Still Legal
    Sarah Verde
    “New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) suggested in a town hall meeting Tuesday that residents of states where marijuana is legal roll their blunts and smoke up before the next presidential inauguration, according to Bloomberg News.

    “If you’re getting high in Colorado today, enjoy it,” said Christie, a 2016 presidential candidate, during the town hall meeting in New Hampshire, according to Bloomberg. “As of January 2017, I will enforce the federal laws.”


  27. Tony says:

    Can Florida Dems Squash Alan Grayson?
    Orlando’s outspoken progressive congressman is running for Marco Rubio’s U.S. Senate seat, and might win the primary—a thought that has Florida Democrats terrified.
    Eleanor Clift


  28. Jamie says:

    Congratulate me. I’ve managed to get myself blocked by Fox News on Facebook…. Apparently they don’t take kindly to being called “Faux Spews” on their own web page. 🙂


  29. patd says:

    from http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/30/politics/bernie-sanders-donald-trump-poll/index.html

    Quinnipiac University poll released Thursday shows that in a hypothetical general election match-up, Sanders tops Trump 44% to 39%. The data point shows that although Trump is leading the GOP pack now, he could prove to be a disaster for Republicans in a broader presidential contest next year.

    Trump also trails Democratic Party frontrunner Hillary Clinton by a margin of 12 percentage points in the poll and to Vice President Joe Biden by 13 percentage points should he join the race and win the party nomination. In contrast, the survey found that former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker to be in a tight race with Clinton.


  30. patd says:

    flatus, this guy’s take on the pollard release may interest you. here’s just a sample:
    from http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/pollards-release-and-why-israel-should-be-wary/
    As an American, I am not in favor of setting Pollard free. As an Israeli, I feel ashamed that my chosen home has made such an effort over decades to get him released. As a Jew I am mortified that the lay leadership in America spearheaded this effort. It is an undeniable fact that Jonathan Pollard committed the most egregious case of espionage in America’s history up until that point. As a government employee, he stole over a million documents, some benign and some highly sensitive and shared them with a foreign government. Under U.S. Code § 2381 treason is punishable by death in America, and if that foreign government were anyone other than Israel, Jonathan Pollard would probably have been dead by now.


  31. Pogo says:

    Whoopee. I got a solicitation for WaPo for $19.99 for a year’s digital access. Now if I can only remember to cancel it next summer before the rate goes up to $99 I’ll be good.

    The disturbing thing about the Pollard case to me is that America’s best friend inthe region (ME) undertook an extensive spying operation against us. THAT is how Israel shows its thanks for our friendship and support? And they showed the current PM (Nettyhoo) lobbying for his release at the end of the Clinton admin Palestine/Israel talks. I find that highly ironic and highly offensive. If ther eever was a reason to scale back our support for Israel, wouldn’t that be one? Or does Israel have us so over a barrel that their bad deeds against the US and our security have to go without consequence? Pollard may have stolen the documents, but Israel paid him to do that.


    • Flatus says:

      Back in 1970? I had the opportunity to talk with a couple of Israeli colonels about an extremely useful, to them, brand new, weapon system that was the cats meow. We were offering it to them for nothing. They basically accused me and the fellas I was with of lying and holding out on them; we weren’t. i wanted to take our bombs and go home. And I’m a Zionist.

      Pollard is the worst of the worst.–a traitor’s traitor. His head should be on a pike in front of the Israeli Embassy.


  32. Flatus says:

    Thank goodness, it just started sprinkling–I have a credible excuse for not cutting the grass today!


    • patd says:

      get some of these. you’ll never have to mow again and all the sweaters, cheese and mutton you would ever want

      J. S. Bach: Cantata Nº 208, ‘Sheep May Safely Graze’


      • Flatus says:

        Lamb chops for dinner tomorrow–Sue and her husband are doing the yard on Saturday. We don’t get enough Bach. That was very nice.


  33. Jamie says:

    Hillary did a fast Q & A with the Skimm. They have invited all the candidates to do the same. So far crickets. http://www.theskimm.com/skimm-your-candidate/hillary-clinton


  34. patd says:

    omg, they actually did something!

    from http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/wp/2015/07/30/senate-clears-highway-bill-patch-averting-a-funding-shutdown/
    Congress successfully averted a lapse in federal funding for road and mass transit projects when the Senate on Thursday approved a three-month extension of the Highway Trust Fund.

    The Senate voted 91 to 4 to clear the House-authored legislation that will allow the funding to continue through Oct. 29 while also providing about $3.4 billion in funding for veterans programs. The Senate also voted 65 to 34 in favor of a separate three-year funding bill that Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) hopes will serve as the starting point for negotiations this fall over a long-term highway bill.


  35. I don’t think the people who support Trump are registered to vote
    Fox is under fire to reveal how they are selecting the candidates

    If I were in the b group I would not attend the debate but organize watching parties with score cards that could be downloaded


  36. blueINdallas says:

    Jamie – Congrats! Ya dunn good!

    Pogo – Maybe it’s fear of the unknown, or, maybe it’s just building on our struggles with vending machines and photocopiers. 🙂

    If we can’t get a quarter back or paper un-jammed, what happens when we have AI-infused tech designed for military purposes? What happens when it disobeys and refuses to power down?


  37. Tony says:

    Trump at 20%, Leading Jeb by 7 in National Polling
    by Taylor Marsh
    “Trump’s 20 percent is the largest tally for a Republican contender in any national poll by the independent Quinnipiac (KWIN-uh-pe-ack) University. Behind Trump are Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker with 13 percent and former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush with 10 percent. No other Republican tops 6 percent and 12 percent are undecided. [Quinnipiac]
    ONE WEEK before the FNC Republican debate Donald Trump sits atop the Republican 2016 field, with Senators Rand Paul and Marco Rubio gasping for relevancy. Trump’s cleared away the ankle biting politicians who were once thought to be possible contenders. It’s all good news for Democrats.

    Marco Rubio stumbling and bumbling to the middle of the pack has to give Team Clinton a sigh of relief. They have Donald Trump to thank for Rubio sagging, whose losing to Jeb in Florida by double digits. Bloomberg reporting

    Rubio was leading the field with 14 percent support in a June 2 poll from CNN. In the same poll on July 26, Rubio tied for fifth place, with 6 percent.

    Rubio was polling seventh in Iowa, the state with the first presidential nominating contest, according to an NBC/Marist poll on Sunday. In New Hampshire, Rubio was in fifth with 6 percent, according to a Monmouth University poll released on Tuesday.

    “I don’t know where Rubio fits in this cycle, or how he distinguishes himself,” said Charlie Bass, a member of Mitt Romney’s presidential steering committee in 2012 and a former U.S. House lawmaker from New Hampshire. “A lot will depend on his presentation in this first debate. That will be an important moment.”
    Unlike Senators Ted Cruz, Lindsey Graham and Rand Paul, Marco Rubio decided to fold his Senate campaign efforts. The reaction financially was that donors of his Senate campaign had to give permission for him to funnel that cash into his presidential efforts. Many did not, according to Bloomberg Politics.

    Yet Marco Rubio had $9.86 million in the bank, according to Bloomberg, as of July 1, which was the most of any Republican.

    John Kasich raised $11 million after announcing. It is a steep, steep climb for him, but if he can get earned media and a boost from the debate he may have a slim shot.

    It’s still very early.

    Next week’s debate, which now will included all 16 candidates (some at 5 p.m., some at 9 p.m.), is going to be fascinating.

    But how do you prep for a debate that has Donald Trump at center stage?”


  38. Tony says:

    Hillary Clinton Voices Support For $12 Minimum Wage, But Balks At $15
    Her hesitance on $15 may displease progressives — but it will relieve businesses that are getting bowled over by minimum wage campaigns.
    Dave Jamieson


    • Jamie says:

      Hillary is the candidate of the “possible”. As wonderful as all the heroic actions may sound, getting them through Congress or negotiated with other world governments is a whole different matter. She may seem too cautious, too secretive, too connected, too whatever, but I truly believe her instincts are in the right place even though she may get there via baby steps rather than grand gestures.


  39. patd says:

    new thread by jamie


  40. Tony says:

    GOP’s epic trainwreck: Jeb Bush flails and Donald Trump ascends as the party goes further off the rails
    As Jeb! drops into third place, Trump gains strength from the disdain of the media and Republican elites


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